Osama bin Laden is Sleeping with Fishes

Three Questions to Ahmad Milad Karimi

Julia Jürgens
In the series New German Stories, which was launched in January 2014 as part of the Academy program, Ahmad Milad Karimi, Professor of Islamic Philosophy and Mysticism at the University of Münster, presented his book Osama bin Laden is Sleeping with Fishes (Osama bin Laden schläft bei den Fischen) at the Academy of the Jewish Museum Berlin on March 10, 2015.

On 9 March 2015 Julia Jürgens did a short interview with Ahmad Milad Karimi and asked him the following three questions:

Julia Jürgens: In your autobiography you bring together Western popular culture and the history of Islamic intellectualism, the translation of the Koran and your PhD thesis on Hegel, Persian mysticism and a penchant for mafia films. If I may make a question of your book’s subtitle: What does Marlon Brando have to do with the pleasure you take in being Muslim?

Ahmad Milad Karimi: That is a secret of the book, a secret concealed first and foremost by the fact that there is always more to people than the pigeonhole we like to keep them in.

Julia Jürgens: Six years ago you published your new translation of the Koran. What motivated you to take up such a challenge and add a new translation to those already in existence?

Ahmad Milad Karimi: The Koran is more than simply a book—it is the poetry of God. The Koran is rhythmic and melodious. It has a beat and a timbre. Every pause for breath is emotional and pregnant with meaning. The way in which the Koran comes into being by creating a resonant space at each reading touches the heart. The Koran is thus an act of beauty and a means to experience God. And it was this, which shaped my decision to translate the Koran, to translate it in such a way as to foreground this spirit, this experience also in the German version.

Julia Jürgens: You and your family fled the war in Afghanistan in 1992. For over a year you were in the hands of traffickers, on an odyssee that took you to New Delhi and Moscow before you finally reached your destination, Germany. In the light of this experience, how do you view “Fortress Europe’s” current policy on refugees and asylum seekers?

Ahmad Milad Karimi: What would Europe be without its refugees? The German philosopher Walter Benjamin, who took his own life when fleeing the Nazis in 1940, noted in his Arcades project that the idea of progress is rooted in the idea of catastrophe: “That ‘it goes on like this’ is the catastrophe.” The real catastrophe is the attitude of the general public to those who are forced to flee, to those who are in search of humanity but only rarely find it. To be able to stay here “on tolerance”, [i.e. be allowed only a provisional residence permit], to have one’s application for asylum “turned down,” to be “deported”—all these are verdicts that concern human beings. But these particular human beings are defined and treated as objects that cost money, that are a burden. By contrast, policy that respects the human rights of refugees and asylum-seekers calls for solidarity and, above all, for a comprehensive package of measures—the first of which must be the right to legal immigration. Europe will fail to meet its own standards of democracy if its asylum policy remains focused not on the needs of people in distress but on the economic interests of each of its member states.

The interview was conducted by Julia Jürgens (Academy program on migration and diversity).

book cover

Ahmad Milad Karimi Osama bin Laden schläft bei den Fischen (“Osama bin Laden is sleeping with fishes”, book cover); Herder Publishers

Citation recommendation: 
Julia Jürgens (2015), Osama bin Laden is Sleeping with Fishes. Three Questions to Ahmad Milad Karimi.
URL: www.jmberlin.de/en/node/6351
Interview Series (12) New German Stories Show all

New German Stories

Since 2014, our colleagues from the Academy program on migration and diversity have been holding regular events at the Jewish Museum in a series called New German Stories. The guests' lives speak to Germany, past and present, as a society of migration, and the events take these life stories as a springboard for exploring these themes. Beforehand, the guests are almost always interviewed. We have compiled these interviews for you here.

Karamba Diaby

26 May 2017
“We should close this representation gap”

Anita Awosusi

6 February 2017
On her book Our Father – A Sinti Family Recounts

Ármin Langer

18 October 2016
“The boredom of peaceful coexistence“

Marion Kraft

6 July 2016
"The part Black soldiers played in the liberation of Germany from Nazism has been largely neglected"

Çiçek Bacık

13 October 2015
“We’ve always been spoken and written about”

Fereshta Ludin

16 September 2015
“I wish more people would look in my eyes instead of at my scarf”

David Ranan

6 July 2015
“Other but not foreign”

Ahmad Milad Karimi

9 March 2015
On his book Osama bin Laden is Sleeping with Fishes

Alina Gromova

8 September 2014
Generation “kosher light”
Young Jews of Russian descent in Berlin

Canan Turan

4 July 2014
Kıymet or:
A cinematic tribute to my grandmother

Urmila Goel and Nisa Punnamparambil-Wolf

19 March 2014
Dealing creatively with ethnic classifications

Alice Bota, Khuê Pham, and Özlem Topçu

29 January 2014
“New German stories”